Advice for boys...

[aumentou]

Hypothetically, if you are ever travelling down a dark path with no side exits and not observers and there's a woman on her own ahead of you on the route, it's not particularly polite to move fast enough that you're catching her up. Better to hang 40 yards back or so - you know, so that if you were hostile she'd have a good head start. Otherwise, she might get twitchy. Also, when she stands to one side and waits for you to pass rather than keeping on moving, that is not your cue to look amused. Yes, YOU know you're not a mugger or a rapist or anything like that. She doesn't. Since you have just moved in a way consistent with an attack, it's not unreasonable for her to be concerned.

Comments

[the-shoveller.livejournal.com]

This strikes me as a no-win situation. Hanging back makes it look like you're lurking.

[mr-s-face.livejournal.com]

Hang further back than that. Ten yards and you're following someone. Further is better. But passing on a narrow path puts the person you're passing in a horribly weak situation - if they carry on walking, you've got a huge window of opportunity in which you're in a perfect strike position. So either they stand aside and let you pass, which means at some point they have no retreat option*, or they run for it straight away.

*
waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall
Them

You

waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall

Since most women aren't prepared for a one-on-one fight with most men, the logical course would be to accelerate her pace so you don't catch up with her, running if necessary. Of course, that's horribly rude of them to rush off like that - so often they don't, and leave themselves trapped in a weak position. But the real rudeness here is from the man - if you are moving fast enough to catch her up, then either you are compelling her to rush, or you're compelling her into a weak position as she gets caught, or you're compelling her into a one-on-one as she stops. Either way, that's not friendly.

[mr-s-face.livejournal.com]

Gah, leading spaces don't work. Move the them and you right a bit.

[astatine210.livejournal.com]

Wrap it all in <pre></pre> tags.

Re: Don't really agree

[rich-jacko.livejournal.com]

^-- I'd echo this. I walk faster than most people, and I'm damned if I'm going to dawdle and make myself late for wherever I'm going.

That said, I will tend to cross the street if I'm rapidly catching up a lone woman ahead of me, for precisely that reason. But there's a limit to what I'll do just because some random person might or might not be paranoid.

Re: Don't really agree

[mr-s-face.livejournal.com]

Paranoid?

Let me ask you a question: If you were walking, alone, at night, and three slightly tipsy football fans came walking up behind you, moving faster than you were, would you move to avoid them?

Re: Don't really agree

[longhairedhippy.livejournal.com]

I sympathise, really I do - I posted something (http://longhairedhippy.livejournal.com/377026.html) on a related subject a couple of years back, however it was filtered so I'll post the gist of it here now (please forgive the waffling)...

...if I'm walking down the street and someone walks towards me, I will instinctively check to see if they're carrying any kind of weapon, looking at me funny or showing any other signs of being about to attack me. I'll size them up to see if I think I could fight them off, and if not, I'll also be subconsciously looking for escape routes, safe places to take refuge in, etc. I absolutely hate being in crowded places with strangers (e.g. busy shopping centres) because I am always fearful of being attacked, or robbed or heaven knows what.

I have another behaviour, which I only noticed the other day - if I'm passing someone on the street, I like to give them around eight to ten feet of space, if I can, if there's space - I don't even realise I'm doing it. I realised why the other day - it's roughly the distance at which I wouldn't be able to attack them without surprise. Essentially I'm keeping the distance needed for each of us to defend ourselves. I have no idea how my view of other human beings got quite so twisted.

I tend to walk faster than a lot of people, so I usually end up closing the distance between me and someone in front. If it's late and there's nobody else about I'll cross the road if possible, just to get me further away from them (feeling is mutual) if that's not possible, e.g. walking down the side of a main road with busy traffic, I'll give them as wide a berth as I can, then move away, same way you would if you were passing horses and didn't want to spook them.

To me, the idea of hanging about behind someone, even at a distance, is just creepy. Believe me, I'd notice, and it would set my alarm bells going.

Re: Don't really agree

[rich-jacko.livejournal.com]

> If you were walking, alone, at night, and three slightly tipsy football fans came walking up behind you, moving faster than you were, would you move to avoid them?

Perhaps. It would depend on how threatening I thought their behaviour was. But that would be my decision to move because of how I felt. I'd never in a million years expect them to guess what I was thinking and move away from me accordingly.

Re: Don't really agree

[mr-s-face.livejournal.com]

It isn't a question of telepathy, it's a question of respect. Your actions have consequences. If you take action that affects someone else and gives them a bunch of unpleasant options, you haven't done something good. You haven't done something neutral either - you've done something bad.

Re: Don't really agree

[glitterybint.livejournal.com]

No, I'd think that they were tipsy football fans and would be entirely self absorbed and non- threatening.

I'd be more worried by a single man on his own.

Re: Don't really agree

[mr-s-face.livejournal.com]

This is a nice example of the differences between violence that men do to men an that they do to women. Most men would answer that the other way round.

Re: Don't really agree

[mr-s-face.livejournal.com]

It's not paranoia for women to be scared of men - it's quite normal.

This article (http://kateharding.net/2009/10/08/guest-blogger-starling-schrodinger%E2%80%99s-rapist-or-a-guy%E2%80%99s-guide-to-approaching-strange-women-without-being-maced/) is slightly more forceful about things than I am, and is focussed on conversational approaches (because it's from the US), but it's a useful read.

Of course, I'm less worried about rape, and more worried about mutilation or death, but the principle is the same.

Re: Don't really agree

[glitterybint.livejournal.com]

it is paranoia because it implies the assumption that all/ most men are out to get you, which is not true. Most of them are harmless. Maybe bumbling and thoughtless and inconsiderate but not actually a threat.

Therefore, if one is percieving a threat which isn't really there then one is paranoid.

[glitterybint.livejournal.com]

staying further back wouldn't make me feel any safer. Crossing the road might, maybe.

it's weird but I don't really find myself in these situations anymore, or I don't really remember feeling threatened very often. When I was younger, before uni maybe I do remember walking home and constantly being on guard, working out what i could do if they attacked me. I dunno, maybe teaching has given me more confidence? more understanding of behaviour? maybe I just don't go out on my own any more? it's very strange!

[child-of-chance.livejournal.com]

That's my experience too. On a dark street with someone behind me, male or female, I'll cross the road if they don't. Them hanging back just makes them look suspicious.
When I was very young I had no sense of fear at all - stupidly, maybe. As I student I used to get very wary but actively protective - stopped wearing scarves, or jewellery on cords, and started carrying sharp umbrellas or heavy things in my bag. Then at some point the extreme nervousness stopped without my realising it, and just left a degree of caution. So now I walk well away from parked cars with lone men in them, cross the road to the well-lit side, and so on. On dark lanes I get to the end quickly but without running. But in the end I just try to look confident and not make eye-contact.

[child-of-chance.livejournal.com]

And not everyone is as well aware of attack methods as you :-)

[mr-s-face.livejournal.com]

"it's weird but I don't really find myself in these situations anymore"

It's not weird at all. You don't go out as much as you used to, even if you're going out you don't often go alone, and you don't usually walk to places because you drive.

[tallbint.livejournal.com]

Good advice, but also good advice to women/men is not to travel down a dark path with no exits on own. Unless carrying a pole arm.

[mayfly182.livejournal.com]

Great. Nova read this over my shoulder and we had a huge argument about it.

[mr-s-face.livejournal.com]

Let me guess - healthy normal-sized martial arts boy isn't scared?

[mayfly182.livejournal.com]

No. Squishy hearted boy really hates the idea that people might find him threatening, and thinks it's really sexist that women would find him threatening but not a woman who was the same size.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_sycorax_/]

I remeber once walking home alone after work and a guy behind me suddenly broke into a run. As he came round the corner I had swung round and was clutching my bag - he jumped out of his skin. He didn't realise I was there. We were both very apologetic and embarrassed.

I felt bad afterwards, partly because the guy was black. I wondered if in fact I had subconsciously assumed he was dangerous for that reason (I appreciate it isn't fair to assume white men are muggers either).

I would agree that you should avoid suddenly breaking into a run behind a lone walker - male or female. Sudden running footsteps are a bit threatening and from a purely selfish perspective if you do spring round a corner at someone they just might panic and lash out at you. It would be entirely unfair and no doubt they would be very sorry about it, but that wouldn't stop it happening. That also applies to women - whilst generally most people aren't threatened by women, a) some people just might be and b) someone who just hears footsteps doesn't know what gender you are.